• @hedgehog
    link
    104 months ago

    Why is “Israeli” in quotes?

    • @Salph@infosec.pub
      link
      fedilink
      68
      edit-2
      4 months ago

      Cuz words like that are usually used for countries, while “israel” is just a western colony in Palestine.

      • Log1cal_Outcome
        cake
        link
        fedilink
        English
        -174 months ago

        I mean, Jewish people originally heralded from around the eastern Mediterranean, middle east? That would make them historically middle eastern rather than western. Or are we strictly talking about western powers giving the Jewish people a ‘homeland’ after the second world war and the holocaust?

        • 420blazeit69 [he/him]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          66
          edit-2
          4 months ago

          Let’s set aside the multiple issues with “I think one of my distant ancestors lived here 2000 years ago, or maybe just other members of my religious group, therefore I have a right to live here today” and assume that yes, that sort of historical/ancestral claim gives comtemporary Jewish people a right to live in Palestine. Even in the most generous light imaginable, it would not give them a right to build an ethnostate by committing genocide on the current inhabitants. Israel is so far past anything that could be reasonably granted from ancient Jews living in Palestine that there is no possible defense along those lines.

          Or are we strictly talking about western powers giving the Jewish people a ‘homeland’ after the second world war and the holocaust?

          Yes, that’s what people mean when they refer to Israel as a colony of Europe/the U.S.

            • SoyViking [he/him]
              link
              fedilink
              English
              444 months ago

              Did apartheid South Africa have a right to defend itself? Did Rhodesia? Did French Algeria?

              No. Regimes like these have one right: The right to be thrown in the dustbin of history and to be replaced by a more just order.

            • 420blazeit69 [he/him]
              link
              fedilink
              English
              404 months ago

              Israel is making it’s own decisions and will happily shrug off any criticism from the Western powers

              There has been zero sincere criticism from the West. If you circumvent Congress to give Israel more money and openly state you are unconditionally supporting it, I don’t buy it if you leak a story about being furious with them behind closed doors. You shouldn’t, either.

          • @NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de
            link
            fedilink
            -23
            edit-2
            4 months ago

            The giant gaping hole in calling Israel a “western colony” is that it has no homeland. It’s not a British colony, or a French colony, or a colony of any other country. If Israel as a country stops existing, the vast majority of its citizens don’t have citizenship in any other country and have literally nowhere else to go. Therefore it’s not a colony and it’s not colonialism, it’s an independent country.

            • idkmybffjoeysteel [he/him]
              link
              fedilink
              English
              404 months ago

              Sure I was born in Britain with British citizenship, but I identify as Middle Eastern so I should be granted somebody else’s land where they are currently living.

              These people should be blasted into fucking space if they need a homeland so badly. Zionism cannot even exist without the antisemitic belief in a fifth column. Are Jews an alien element in Western society, or do they belong to the societies in which they were born?

              I will tell you this: Middle Eastern people do not eat schnitzel.

            • 420blazeit69 [he/him]
              link
              fedilink
              English
              404 months ago

              When the British expelled criminals to Australia they couldn’t return home. Was Australia not a colony? A ton of European immigrants to the American colonies intended their journeys to be one-way trips, and were functionally barred from returning by cost. Does that mean there were no colonies in the Americas?

              Besides, throughout history you almost never see settlers leaving en masse when colonial administrations end. Sure, some recent arrivees may turn around, and some administrators who moved there mostly to work in the colonial government may leave, but you really never see the main body of settlers leave. You didn’t even have this in South Africa. They simply have to live under a government where they can’t shoot the locals with impunity.

              • @NeatNit@discuss.tchncs.de
                link
                fedilink
                -144 months ago

                That doesn’t really address the point though… Israel is independent, and was so from the start. It’s not bound to any other western country’s rule, which is the first requirement for being a colony.

                • 420blazeit69 [he/him]
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  384 months ago

                  the vast majority of its citizens don’t have citizenship in any other country and have literally nowhere else to go. Therefore it’s not a colony

                  It directly refutes this.

                  If you’re leaning on Israel being formally independent, they’re about as independent from the West (particularly the U.S.) as a college freshman getting their tuition paid by Mom and Dad. No one here is talking about Israel being independent on paper, we’re talking about how it interacts with other countries in reality.

            • GarbageShoot [he/him]
              link
              fedilink
              English
              374 months ago

              You know that many Israelis did come from anglosphere or now-EU states, right? It’s not like it’s just a new social formation of people who already lived in the region.

        • Bnova [he/him]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          564 months ago

          Can I just lay claim to random pieces of land in Africa? I mean all people came from there at one point right?

        • idkmybffjoeysteel [he/him]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          474 months ago

          I declare all of Sweden a homeland for the oppressed Stalinists (I have an incredibly remote connection to Norse settlers along with almost everyone else in my country)

        • Xavienth
          link
          fedilink
          394 months ago

          Don’t ask why genetic tests are banned in Israel, worst mistake of my life

        • GarbageShoot [he/him]
          link
          fedilink
          English
          384 months ago

          It’s a project overwhelmingly lead by western states that has resulted in a huge importing of people who were born and raised in western states pretending they are indigenous to the region. If not for the west, Israel would neither have the resources to maintain its colonial project nor the population needed for occupying Palestine.