No they aren’t. You and others are being ableist because
You refuse to engage with what a Tourettes diagnosis entails
You continue to behave as if this was somehow a conscious choice, even when informed otherwise
You and others want him to either stay out of public vision or stop having Tourettes
You argue that Tourettes is not something that impacts the one with the diagnosis. Like you are Cartman.
You act as though his tics somehow reveal something about his morality
I haven’t seen anyone say anything akin to “actually it was really cool and awesome he said that slur and you’re ableist if you think otherwise”.
Edit: and I can see from the other thread that you know all this already as it has been explained to you several times. So I don’t know why you keep arguing against a position you know noone holds, nor why you keep ignoring the actual arguments set forth for you.
You refuse to engage with what a Tourettes diagnosis entails
A bad faith user pretended I believed Tourette’s makes people develop racist beliefs. I never said this, I never believed it, and now multiple users have spread this lie, I explained multiple times a medical condition can induce unintentional racist ACTIONS, not internal racist beliefs, ACTIONS, I clarified that distinction multiple times hence my point of intent does not erase impact
You continue to behave as if this was somehow a conscious choice, even when informed otherwise
I have clarified multiple times intent does not negate impact, that implies I do NOT believe it was a conscious choice, again you’re spreading lies
You and others want him to either stay out of public vision or stop having Tourettes
In the very specific context of inflicting racial abuse on other people because of a neurological condition, then avoidance OR ANY OTHER harm reduction strategies become viable, because the harm is no longer individualized as racial abuse is a very specific thing, REGARDLESS OF INTENT
This does not apply to most sufferers of Tourette’s because racism (which does not require intent to be inflicted) is not synonymous with the typical inconvenience, annoyance, or uncomfortableness typical Tourette’s sufferers deal with on an individual level and I NEVER CLAIMED “he should stop having Tourettes” what a blatant lie
You argue that Tourettes is not something that impacts the one with the diagnosis
I said the impact of slurs is not something he has to deal with, his disability is the explanation for why it happened and he has to deal with his condition, that does not mean the n-word impacts him in any way similar to the way it impacted the cast of Sinners, again you’re a liar and a weasel trying to twist my words, disengage and kick rocks
Gaslighting is when you point out what a person is doing, when that person does not like being confronted with what it is they are doing.
A bad faith user pretended I believed Tourette’s makes people develop racist beliefs. I never said this, I never believed it, and now multiple users have spread this lie,
A user pointed out the logical conclusion of the arguments you put forth. It was, and is, clear you attach a moral value to the tics.
I explained multiple times a medical condition can induce unintentional racist ACTIONS, not internal racist beliefs, ACTIONS, I clarified that distinction multiple times hence my point of intent does not erase impact
Come on, none of us are liberals here. We understand that just because you say one thing it does not stop you from doing another.
Here’s what I think has happened: You consider yourself a leftist. A leftist isn’t ableist, so obviously you aren’t. When it was pointed out to you how what you were doing was ableist, you got super heated and didn’t actually engage with the argument, because it was so obviously wrong, since you’re a leftist. No reason to interrogate your own beliefs or arguments. And now you’re locked up, getting more and more mad, because you keep getting confronted with your ableist arguments.
I have clarified multiple times intent does not negate impact, that implies I do NOT believe it was a conscious choice, again you’re spreading lies
And you have multiple times put forth arguments that only function if it is a conscious choice. I’m not spreading lies, I’m just saying stuff you don’t enjoy hearing.
In the very specific context of inflicting racial abuse on other people because of a neurological condition, then avoidance OR ANY OTHER harm reduction strategies become viable, because the harm is no longer individualized as racial abuse is a very specific thing, REGARDLESS OF INTENT
In other words: He should stay out of public view. This is not harm reduction, it is ableist.
This does not apply to most sufferers of Tourette’s because racism (which does not require intent to be inflicted) is not synonymous with the typical inconvenience, annoyance, or uncomfortableness typical Tourette’s sufferers deal with on an individual level
And here we have you attaching a moral value as well as implying some level of conscious choice on his part. He’s separate from most sufferers, somehow. He’s not typical. It’s clear you don’t actually understand what tourettes is or does, despite it being explained a bunch of times already.
I NEVER CLAIMED “he should stop having Tourettes” what a blatant lie
It’s either that or stay out of public view, as I said. That’s what people have pointed out to you a bunch of times before, yet you keep not engaging with it.
I said the impact of slurs is not something he has to deal with, his disability is the explanation for why it happened and he has to deal with his condition, that does not mean the n-word impacts him in any way similar to the way it impacted the cast of Sinners, again you’re a liar and a weasel trying to twist my words, disengage and kick rocks
In a metaphor about tourettes being like a colostomy bag bursting, you argued that it was different because it didn’t hurt him. You did not argue specifically as you claim to do now. Yet somehow I’m the one lying and twisting words.
Disengage
The disengage function is not a magical “get the last word” button. Attempting to use it as such is incredibly weasely lol. I think if you go and :logout: and come back in a day or so, you’ll probably be less heated and realise how locked up you were beforehand.
It will probably be best for both of us if this interaction stops however, so I am going to stop replying. Hopefully this helps with getting you to cool off a bit.
It’s clear you don’t consider anything that happened that night to be actually harmful to Black people, because hey, “it wasn’t intentional,” and apparently that’s all that matters to you, because in your mind intent can negate impact and any action taken to mitigate that impact is ableist since intent trumps the harm
I’m not wasting my time with people who lie, twist words and deny basic concepts of medical ethics
You are very mad about me “twisting your words” and “lying”, but you keep doing the same yourself. Is this because you don’t realise it or because you think it doesn’t count when you do it? Of course I consider it harmful, as I have already said. I thought saying things meant you were immune to all accusations or logical conclusions? I personally think it would be fitting if he apologised. I don’t think he is racist because of a tic, nor do I think it’s racist to react negatively to arguments or behaviour like yours.
It’s clear you don’t consider anything that happened that night to be actually harmful to Black people, because hey, “it wasn’t intentional,” and apparently that’s all that matters to you, because in your mind intent can negate impact and any action taken to mitigate that impact is ableist since intent trumps the harm
Call me crazy, but I don’t think we should lock up people with tourettes, even when they say hurtful things.
medical ethics
Is medical ethics when you want to lock up people with tourettes and you attach moral values to their tics?
Kinda rich to hear you speak of medicine, when you so far have failed to engage with what tourettes is or does.
I personally think it would be fitting if he apologised
I love this. In the end they agree with you but still want to spit essays worth of bullshit at you just to make sure you know who’s boss
I don’t think he is racist because of a tic, nor do I think it’s racist to react negatively to arguments or behaviour like yours.
Again, there’s the crux of why your cracker brain doesn’t understand a thing I’m saying, he doesn’t need to BE a racist to perform racist ACTIONS, again intent does not negate impact
Call me crazy, but I don’t think we should lock up people with tourettes, even when they say hurtful things.
Now I want to lock them up and throw away the key!!! As if avoidance of triggers isn’t actually a real treatment plan for sufferers of Tourettes, do I really need to pull up a Tourette’s advocate saying the exact same thing before it penetrates your skull, I mean I better not since the advocate in the link is Black and you may take issue with that. Fuck it, disengage and go yell at him https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgaqKIxS4Hs
Again, there’s the crux of why your cracker brain doesn’t understand a thing I’m saying, he doesn’t need to BE a racist to perform racist ACTIONS, again intent does not negate impact
See again you keep arguing against things I haven’t said. Why do you insist on making discussion much more difficult? Why did you ignore it when I responded in detail last time? It seems like you’re just doing this for the dopamine or something like that.
Now I want to lock them up and throw away the key!!!
No, you just want to keep them out of public view. I suppose throwing away the key would help with that.
As if avoidance of triggers isn’t actually a real treatment plan for sufferers of Tourettes, do I really need to pull up a Tourette’s advocate saying the exact same thing before it penetrates your skull
And again: If they do not follow this treatment or they are not far along it, then what? You have an incredibly narrow view of who is allowed to be part of public life.
I mean I better not since the advocate in the link is Black and you may take issue with that.
So where have I said anything that would give you that idea? You’ve freaked out about me “twisting your words” and “being a lying weasel” for pointing out how you are being ableist. So I must assume you have a direct quote of me that points this out. Should I worry for him because he has tourettes and that might make you want him disappeared? Oh hey here’s another black man talking about the situation.
Disengage
Second time I’m telling you this, which is a great example of you not actually engaging with what people are writing: Disengage does not function like a “get the last word” button. It was actually implemented to protect our neurodivergent users - Both from getting into a viscious cycle of continuing a pointless argument, like we are doing, and from before we had the block function. Kinda fitting that you are misusing something originally intended for ND people.
I’ll show you how to properly use it by your next reply - See how polite I am, I’m even letting you know so you can get the last word! Call me cracker all you want! Continue to read something I didn’t write and argue against that!
Sir, this an incredibly reasonable, well thought-out, and visibly good faith reply, so I hesitate to even speak to one such as yourself, but, if I may, disengage must be the only word in your reply. It is not a spell you can trigger upon using other abilities. Mind the technicalities.
Yeah? No one is arguing that it doesn’t
Yes, they are, that’s what the accusations of ableism are amounting to
No they aren’t. You and others are being ableist because
I haven’t seen anyone say anything akin to “actually it was really cool and awesome he said that slur and you’re ableist if you think otherwise”.
Edit: and I can see from the other thread that you know all this already as it has been explained to you several times. So I don’t know why you keep arguing against a position you know noone holds, nor why you keep ignoring the actual arguments set forth for you.
Spare me the bullshit gaslighting
A bad faith user pretended I believed Tourette’s makes people develop racist beliefs. I never said this, I never believed it, and now multiple users have spread this lie, I explained multiple times a medical condition can induce unintentional racist ACTIONS, not internal racist beliefs, ACTIONS, I clarified that distinction multiple times hence my point of intent does not erase impact
I have clarified multiple times intent does not negate impact, that implies I do NOT believe it was a conscious choice, again you’re spreading lies
In the very specific context of inflicting racial abuse on other people because of a neurological condition, then avoidance OR ANY OTHER harm reduction strategies become viable, because the harm is no longer individualized as racial abuse is a very specific thing, REGARDLESS OF INTENT
This does not apply to most sufferers of Tourette’s because racism (which does not require intent to be inflicted) is not synonymous with the typical inconvenience, annoyance, or uncomfortableness typical Tourette’s sufferers deal with on an individual level and I NEVER CLAIMED “he should stop having Tourettes” what a blatant lie
I said the impact of slurs is not something he has to deal with, his disability is the explanation for why it happened and he has to deal with his condition, that does not mean the n-word impacts him in any way similar to the way it impacted the cast of Sinners, again you’re a liar and a weasel trying to twist my words, disengage and kick rocks
Gaslighting is when you point out what a person is doing, when that person does not like being confronted with what it is they are doing.
A user pointed out the logical conclusion of the arguments you put forth. It was, and is, clear you attach a moral value to the tics.
Come on, none of us are liberals here. We understand that just because you say one thing it does not stop you from doing another.
Here’s what I think has happened: You consider yourself a leftist. A leftist isn’t ableist, so obviously you aren’t. When it was pointed out to you how what you were doing was ableist, you got super heated and didn’t actually engage with the argument, because it was so obviously wrong, since you’re a leftist. No reason to interrogate your own beliefs or arguments. And now you’re locked up, getting more and more mad, because you keep getting confronted with your ableist arguments.
And you have multiple times put forth arguments that only function if it is a conscious choice. I’m not spreading lies, I’m just saying stuff you don’t enjoy hearing.
In other words: He should stay out of public view. This is not harm reduction, it is ableist.
And here we have you attaching a moral value as well as implying some level of conscious choice on his part. He’s separate from most sufferers, somehow. He’s not typical. It’s clear you don’t actually understand what tourettes is or does, despite it being explained a bunch of times already.
It’s either that or stay out of public view, as I said. That’s what people have pointed out to you a bunch of times before, yet you keep not engaging with it.
In a metaphor about tourettes being like a colostomy bag bursting, you argued that it was different because it didn’t hurt him. You did not argue specifically as you claim to do now. Yet somehow I’m the one lying and twisting words.
The disengage function is not a magical “get the last word” button. Attempting to use it as such is incredibly weasely lol. I think if you go and :logout: and come back in a day or so, you’ll probably be less heated and realise how locked up you were beforehand.
It will probably be best for both of us if this interaction stops however, so I am going to stop replying. Hopefully this helps with getting you to cool off a bit.
It’s clear you don’t consider anything that happened that night to be actually harmful to Black people, because hey, “it wasn’t intentional,” and apparently that’s all that matters to you, because in your mind intent can negate impact and any action taken to mitigate that impact is ableist since intent trumps the harm
I’m not wasting my time with people who lie, twist words and deny basic concepts of medical ethics
You are very mad about me “twisting your words” and “lying”, but you keep doing the same yourself. Is this because you don’t realise it or because you think it doesn’t count when you do it? Of course I consider it harmful, as I have already said. I thought saying things meant you were immune to all accusations or logical conclusions? I personally think it would be fitting if he apologised. I don’t think he is racist because of a tic, nor do I think it’s racist to react negatively to arguments or behaviour like yours.
Call me crazy, but I don’t think we should lock up people with tourettes, even when they say hurtful things.
Is medical ethics when you want to lock up people with tourettes and you attach moral values to their tics?
Kinda rich to hear you speak of medicine, when you so far have failed to engage with what tourettes is or does.
I love this. In the end they agree with you but still want to spit essays worth of bullshit at you just to make sure you know who’s boss
Again, there’s the crux of why your cracker brain doesn’t understand a thing I’m saying, he doesn’t need to BE a racist to perform racist ACTIONS, again intent does not negate impact
Now I want to lock them up and throw away the key!!! As if avoidance of triggers isn’t actually a real treatment plan for sufferers of Tourettes, do I really need to pull up a Tourette’s advocate saying the exact same thing before it penetrates your skull, I mean I better not since the advocate in the link is Black and you may take issue with that. Fuck it, disengage and go yell at him https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgaqKIxS4Hs
Great way to engage with text. Really nailing the debatebro vibe.
Buddy, I do not agree with you at all
See again you keep arguing against things I haven’t said. Why do you insist on making discussion much more difficult? Why did you ignore it when I responded in detail last time? It seems like you’re just doing this for the dopamine or something like that.
No, you just want to keep them out of public view. I suppose throwing away the key would help with that.
And again: If they do not follow this treatment or they are not far along it, then what? You have an incredibly narrow view of who is allowed to be part of public life.
So where have I said anything that would give you that idea? You’ve freaked out about me “twisting your words” and “being a lying weasel” for pointing out how you are being ableist. So I must assume you have a direct quote of me that points this out. Should I worry for him because he has tourettes and that might make you want him disappeared? Oh hey here’s another black man talking about the situation.
Second time I’m telling you this, which is a great example of you not actually engaging with what people are writing: Disengage does not function like a “get the last word” button. It was actually implemented to protect our neurodivergent users - Both from getting into a viscious cycle of continuing a pointless argument, like we are doing, and from before we had the block function. Kinda fitting that you are misusing something originally intended for ND people.
I’ll show you how to properly use it by your next reply - See how polite I am, I’m even letting you know so you can get the last word! Call me cracker all you want! Continue to read something I didn’t write and argue against that!
Sir, this an incredibly reasonable, well thought-out, and visibly good faith reply, so I hesitate to even speak to one such as yourself, but, if I may, disengage must be the only word in your reply. It is not a spell you can trigger upon using other abilities. Mind the technicalities.
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
there are black folks with tourettes, some of them are on social media
There sure is https://x.com/OGBlackRedGuard/status/2026149263692976615