Luminous5481 [they/them]

zionism and anarchism are mutually exclusive ideologies. you cannot be an anarchist and support a ethnocultural supremacist settler state, as solidarity for all people and freedom from oppression is a foundational component of anarchism. it is as you said earlier:

That said, this may simply reflect my own (maybe) culturally liberal outlook

you are simply more accepting of racism and genocide than any anarchist would be.

Not intercepting the PMs plane and arresting him for the ICC warrant is also illegal under international law. Israel can’t legally occupy the settlements that they do, that’s a violation of international law. They can’t bomb refugee camps, that’s a violation of international law. They can’t starve Palestinians intentionally, that’s against international law. They can’t refuse medical help to injured civilians or Hamas fighters who cannot fight anymore, that’s against international law.

I’m assuming, as somebody quoting some random treaty to me, that you’re a liberal who views laws and legality as the order that holds our world together. It must come as a real shock to you that no state actually gives a shit about what’s legal, they only care about what they can get away with. Unless you can force your government to abide by a law, they can do whatever the fuck they want. That’s the neat thing about laws, they don’t mean shit unless the government in question decides to abide by them.

Surely shooting them down if they haven’t faced a trial can’t be protocol

That absolutely is protocol when an aircraft invades your airspace and refuses to turn around or land when intercepted. It’s happened before, and depending on the country, sometimes they don’t give the intercepted aircraft a warning before they open fire. Sometimes they even fire warning shots, but the interloper doesn’t see them.

That happened more than once with Korean civilian airliners that strayed into the USSR.

That’s real great, Mr Hackerman. But you said you were a Zionist. You’re not part of any movement we’re aligned with. You’re the ideological enemy of all anarchists, and anyone who wants to liberate the land of Palestine from its European colonial settler state. Our movement won’t get smaller if you’re gone, because our movement opposes the existence of all who support ethnocultural supremacist states. You are everything we are struggling against, and we will not ever stop fighting.

Long live the global intifada!

Honestly, fuck you you illiterate moron. If I’m a horrible person, you’re a damn idiot who can’t read. I am someone who actively wanted ICC prosecutions, who considered doing activism work supporting the ICC regarding this, but you know what? Fuck you, fuck this movement, fuck this instance, I don’t want to be treated this way, ban me, kick me out of the movement, keep your political movement nice and exclusive. I am way less likely to do anything regarding this movement at all, including supporting the ICC in any way. If I’m so horrible, then fuck you, I won’t advocate for ICC prosecutions or support this cause at all, apparently I’m not welcome and want genocide… that’s literally what I am saying, right?

You were never going to “do anything for this movement” in the first place, so I don’t think anyone is going to miss you now that you’ve taken off the mask and shown your true colors.

yes, that is what you said. don’t get sarcastic about it after the fact. your justification for supporting a genocide is hand wringing about what might happen to trans kids if you don’t. you pulled a “think of the children” to justify murdering children.

you are absolutely a horrible person and should be ashamed to have said something so incredibly vile and hateful.

jewish people need a place to go

well maybe don’t kill everyone who was already there

if you asked someone that is born and raised in Israel, he probably feels like you are stealing his land when you take it away from him too

that is literally what you said tho

dataprolet was brought up in the matrix chat the other day, and it was decided somebody should make a gov post about whether or not someone like them should be associated with the rest of us.

did you really just use the “think of the children!” argument to justify bombing innocent kids?

you can’t make this shit up.

makes zero sense

that about sums up religion in general, well done. I think that about wraps the thread up, honestly. good work, everyone!

zionism and anarchism are mutually exclusive idealogies. you cannot believe in solidarity for all mankind and also support an ethnocutural supremacist movement.

I support banning zionists from dbzer0 to match them being banned on Anarchist Nexus.

Except your instance is federated and you do have to contend with me.

yeah, I don’t really think that’s true, all things considered.

I asked you an honest question and instead of answering it you avoided the question because you don’t want to contend with an honest debate

I am not interested in debating whether or not I should associate with ethnocutural supremacists.

I also don’t like your radical response to poor sources or arguments.

first of all, I never asked what you do or do not like. nobody did. you’re not part of the flotilla, or one of the instances thinking of joining the flotilla. you shouldn’t even be here, since this thread is not for you and your voice is not recognized and will not be considered when the decision is made.

my “poor arguments” are nothing more than arguments that you are either incapable or unwilling of understanding. likely the latter, since even a child is capable of love for each other.

Represent yourself better and raise your own standards.

my standards for association are clearly much higher than yours.

If there were no borders, I would be concerned that Arabs would move to my area and have tons of subhuman kids

I fixed it for you so it more closely aligns with your ideology

Zionism is an ethnocultural nationalist movement that emerged in late 19th-century Europe; it primarily seeks to establish and support a Jewish homeland through the colonization of Palestine, which roughly corresponds to the Land of Israel in Judaism—itself central to Jewish history. Zionists wanted to create a Jewish state in Palestine with as much land, as many Jews, and as few Palestinian Arabs as possible.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionism

The real question should be do you want to be an echo chamber?

an anarchist echo chamber? yes, please. I will not ever, at any time, under any circumstances, for any reason, for any person, even for a second, consider any ideology, opinion, or idea, that does not include solidarity for all mankind. I’m not interested in your “devils advocate”, or your debate, or your differing opinion. if it is not helping your fellow man and lifting people up, freeing them from oppression from religions and states, then I want nothing ever to do with it.

you cannot change my mind.

So, let me ask clearly, do you think I am a Zionist?

I do not care if you are. you’re not on our instance. we’re not being forced to associate with you. you probably thought you had some sort of “got you!” argument lined up. but I’m not concerned with whether or not some random .worlder supports genocide. this time tomorrow, I’ll have forgotten you exist.

the only thing I’m doing here is making sure anyone else who wanders by does not see your absolutely wrong position and think being a zionist and an anarchist are anything but mutually exclusive ideologies.

So because you believe the other side of your view is morally and legally wrong they don’t deserve representation

they can have representation elsewhere. banning them here does not keep them from taking part in the fediverse.

Except I didn’t call you racist, I implied you followed the same ideology of racists.

that was an attempt at clever wordplay that means absolutely nothing. you’re not good at this.

You see people who are functionally the same as you

nobody who is a zionist is “functionally the same as” anarchists. the two ideologies are diametrically opposed and cannot function together.

You’ve taken someone who agrees with your ideals

no zionist agrees with my ideals, or they would no be a zionist. you cannot agree with my ideals and support a racist genocidal apartheid regime.

and ostracized them for not saying things the way you want.

anarchists voluntarily associate into communities of like-minded individuals. this is a right that cannot be infringed upon. likewise, the right to disassociate from people who are not like-minded is also a right that cannot be infringed. they are a foundation of anarchist thought. any zionist is free to form their own associations of like-minded individuals. banning zioonism from our community does not infringe on their rights, nor impede them in any way from speech.

I hate to break it to you, but that is exactly what authoritarianism is.

no, it is not.