I hope younger people have already seen the nakedness of this process with the climate movement in the past few years and have learned from it.

i think answers like this are maybe too concerned with theoretic purity and maintaining a certain label.

Having a clear message and working towards the goals of the movement is not “being concerned with theoretic purity”. Words have meanings for a practical purpose, and stripping those meanings away makes it more difficult to organise.

A living being created to suffer and die for an abominable purpose and then not even used for that purpose. It’s like a mockery and just takes the complete lack of respect for life they have to a higher level. In my mind at least.

The issue here is that this is just untackled speciesistic thinking. It’s not “respectful” to consume the flesh of someone who was killed, nor is it worse to “waste” the products of their exploitation.
Every human under capitalism is “created” to serve capital. It is not a “waste” if they were to die without getting completely exploited for all of their labour power to the day they die, except through the lens of a capitalist.

I mean most of them still like the taste and texture of corpses thus the booming replacement market. So it’s more like they’re forcing themselves to be vegan. Repressing their urges though the urge is still present. […] You can’t really consciously decide to not crave something.

People like certain tastes and textures, especially things they are used to. There is no reason to give up something they like if they can have it without murdering someone. The same applies for clothing and entertainment. There are no supernatural urges or cravings, and practising a vegan lifestyle is not a stoic struggle towards noble virtues through suffering.
Changing any habit takes some time and adjustment, there is nothing special about it.

But as we know most people ‘‘quit veganism’’.

Actually, no, we don’t "know most people ‘quit veganism’’. A lot of people go on plant-based diets for any number of reasons and call it “going vegan” because the word vegan has become synonymous with plant-based food in many countries (this has both positive and negative consequences, but it’s out of the scope of this discussion) and is often used as a marketing term.
People quit all sorts of diets all the time. It’s nothing out of the ordinary.

It does not take much investigation to find that the overwhelming majority of people who say they are “ex-vegan” have never had anything to do with the movement at all. There are some examples of activists going “ex-vegan” and it gets very publicised, but ultimately it’s a very small number of people.

I don’t necessarily see his behavior as a problem as it’s not actually contributing to the industry to eat what would go to waste. Do i think he can call himself a vegan? Probably not, but I don’t really care honestly. It’s just a label.

I’m not interested in any one person, nor am I trying to be the “label” police. My take regarding this has to do with organising and how having concrete terms with concrete meanings is crucial to that process; this is not exclusive to veganism.
There are practical reasons behind the labelling of certain organisations and individuals as “TERFs” rather than just “Feminists”, for example.

What really matters is the consequences of one’s actions. Which in his case don’t seem to be negative.

Like I said, others in this thread have already tackled this, so there is no reason for me to rehash it here, but in short, I do not agree that the consequences of those actions are not negative.

Ultimately, I believe you focus too much on individuals and individual actions rather than the big picture and how the movement as a whole, not individual vegans, should conduct itself.

My perspective is shaped by my experience in organising locally and engaging with dozens of other organisations nationally and internationally. I have seen many strategies from across the spectrum, many mistakes (made many myself), and many successes. I started organising first, then arrived at theory later out of practical necessity.

“Without revolutionary theory, there can be no revolutionary movement.”,
“[…]practice gropes in the dark if its path is not illumined by revolutionary theory.”, etc. etc.

It’s not through a concern of “theoretic purity”, rather a practical concern with driving the movement forward.

Questions like this are fundamentally caused by either a core misunderstanding of veganism, or a severe detachment from the reality of animal agriculture and exploitation.

If you have to face that reality, either through engaging in activism or watching (not skimming) documentaries, then you will never look at a hacked-off piece of a carcass or the secretions of an animal that was forcibly impregnated, had their child ripped away from them then murdered at a few hours old as “food”. Nor would you look at a garment fashioned from their literal skin as “clothes”.

Others in this thread have already highlighted some of the issues that come from someone calling themselves “vegan” consuming animal products in front of other people, and how this concept of “waste” is inherently flawed, so I won’t spend time on those points.

Ultimately, everyone needs to understand that veganism is an animal liberation movement, not a diet. It has nothing to do with environmentalism, “waste”, sustainability, altruism, or any moralistic framing. If you’re at a stage where you’re consuming the dead bodies of animals for any reason other than desperate survival, it shows that you simply don’t have the fundamental theoretical nor practical knowledge to further the cause of the movement.

The advice is as always: read theory, organise, agitate; but in the case of veganism also crucially: see with your own eyes the reality of what we’ve all been socialised to accept.
I’ve met many “vegans” who said to me that they’ve never sat down and watched what happens with their own eyes, or have never joined an org. None of them are serious about animal liberation beyond lip service.

The Chinese yearn for barely-disguised furry media.

Sky is blue.

I’ve debated whether or not I should post this, but I’ve been feeling quite disappointed with the quality of comments on Hexbear threads recently.

Since many threads are crossposted between here and there, I would often read the comments on both threads for different perspectives (and to be honest, for more content in general).
In the last few weeks, however, I’ve been finding myself again and again in situations where I read the Lemmygrad thread and it’s completely fine, and then when I check the Hexbear crosspost I would find the comments to be, for lack of a better phrase, an absolute dumpster fire.

Not sure if it’s just me, maybe unlucky coincidences, or something of a pattern that I’ve just missed.
I don’t mean to be negative, it’s just been bothering me lately.

Terrible, ignorant, short-sighted, and non-reflexive post.

I hope you take this down and post to c/selfcrit once you have reflected on what others have said to you.

At least they’re not promoting opioid abuse.

You sure it’s not a poppy? lol.

Diplomatic relations have strained between socialist Lemmy instances Hexbear and Lemmygrad as /c/chapotraphouse@hexbear.net, one of Hexbear’s most active and influential communities, ceases federation with Lemmygrad.

The seizure in federation was first noted by Lemmygrad user @Saymaz@lemmygrad.ml, who submitted an inquiry to the Embassy of Hexbear on Lemmygrad.

“For some reason the chapotraphouse comm [sic] isn’t federating with lemmygrad.”
-Hexbear moderator @thelastaxolotl@hexbear.net confirms.

As of the time of writing, no definite cause for the issue has been made public.
Lemmygrad and Hexbear admins are yet to provide an official statement.

Update:
Lemmygrad and Hexbear admins, @GrainEater@lemmygrad.ml and @CARCOSA@hexbear.net respectively, have confirmed that the issue regarding /c/chapotraphouse@hexbear.net’s federation with Lemmygrad is not intentional.

“We have not deliberately defederated from any Hexbear community. This is likely just a bug.”
-GrainEater

“There was nothing done on hexbear’s end from either mod or admin with regard to the federation of c/chapotraphouse@hexbear.net”
-CARCOSA

The root cause of the disruption is still under investigation.

I read a few articles by a socialist, feminist, transgender, latina, survivor of the sex trade (her words) called Esperanza Fonseca who goes by “Proletarian Feminist” on Medium that I found really insightful.
I think it would really help us in this conversation to critically examine and reflect upon articles such as these:

1. A Socialist, Feminist, and Transgender Analysis of “Sex Work”
2. The Problem with Sex Trade Expansionary Feminism, A Response to Kate
3. The problem with the phrase “sex work is work”

She also spoke about this topic alongside Brigid Ó Coileáin, a marxist feminist who hosts the “Probably Cancelled Podcast”, on an episode of Rev Left Radio called “Proletarian Feminism, Women’s Liberation, and the Sex Trade” from 2021.

Getting drafted into the reserve army of labour kinda sucks.

Counterpoint: saying “another kkkrakkka down” to “normies” is really funny.

All links in the post appear to be broken.

I keep lying to myself that “one day we’ll have a discussion about AI on Lemmygrad that is not entirely bad faith” and call it revolutionary optimism. 🫠

Tofu my beloved.

I have very little sympathy for tech workers in the first world.

Is this still the case? I thought this was slowly falling out of style, but maybe it depends on the place.

More and more in my experience it goes something like:
“How’s it going?”
“It’s going”
“Yeaaah…”

What do you think the situation in the EU is gearing up towards in the next 4 years? At some point something has to budge. If I have a right read on it, the further right parties in EU countries aren’t super thrilled with the defence spending, further deindustrialisation, and worsening relations with Russia regarding Ukraine and the energy crisis.

I haven’t seen much that gives me hope that the left would be able to capitalise on this more than already-popular far-right parties. I’m not very familiar with the situation in countries like Belgium and the Netherlands though.

Ok, but why is this bad?