- cross-posted to:
- fuckcars@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- fuckcars@lemmy.world
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As I understand the story, Michelin made tires for cars… and people drive in cars. Maybe if people had a handy guide that told them all the best places to eat, they’d start driving to those places… thus the Michelin Guide was born!
There is also an interesting video by tasting history about this: https://youtu.be/-Y_TWPbmiRE
IIRC these even used the guide in a world war because of how good the maps in it were.
I deadass thought the tire company and the restoraunt rating system were two completely different and unrelated things. Wow
I thought so too for the longest time. My wife is a chef though, so it’s come up a couple of times since we got together…
Does she have a star?
lol, na. She doesn’t even work in kitchens anymore and has less than no desire to. Too stressful and shitty hours. Plus, with some of her chronic conditions, the hours and hours standing would be unbearable.
She makes some of the best god damned food I’ve ever tasted though…
Working in kitchens is hell. Also somehow fun. I wouldn’t do it again, but it was certainly an experience.
Concur… when I worked food service, I worked front of house. I hated the work, but the camaraderie among the weight staff was great. Definitely grew as a person in that time. Mutual experience with food service is part of how we fell in love.
That’s cool, and you’re right about the camaraderie. I’ve never had another job where we’d all sit around and drink and talk for hours after a shift. Sure, I’ve made friends at other jobs, but serving was a completely different animal.
Well, I mean, she has a brown star …
As do most people, but the comment you’re replying to is the short and sweet of how it happened.
Thats some deep state level stuff. What if restaurants recommended tyres so people could continue to drive to their restaurant without worrying about safety.
That’s no deep state level stuff, what the top comment describes is just what happened. Back in the day (60’s), advertising was very different from now. Some advertisements were quite long and explained the product in some depth, more like an infomercial. Others were meant to be useful or entertaining with the product more off to the side, like the michelin stars. Soaps are also a good example of this. Soap companies used to make elaborate household dramas to target their primary customers: Housewives. That is why we call soaps soaps, because the genre was invented/vastly utilized by soap companies.
Back in the day (60’s),
The Michelin guide exists since 1900 even.
Similarly, the Guinness of the beer and the Guinness of the book of records are the same Guinness. Michelin started as a tire company when there were only approximately 4000 cars in all of France, their home country, and started the restaurant guide as a way of increasing demand for travel, and therefore cars, and therefore tires for cars. Guinness the brewery started the list of records as something to keep on hand to settle arguments in pubs
Also, the t-studend distribution (way more important than the normal distribution imo) was born in a research lab for Guinness.
what‽ how is the student t distribution more important than the normal distribution?? you can’t even use the t unless you’ve confirmed that you’ve got a normal! 📈📉
Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t the student t distribution a set of distributions that includes the normal distribution?
Because if so, it feels a little like saying “you can’t even call something red unless you’ve confirmed that it’s crimson”
The t-distribution approaches the normal distribution with increasing degrees of freedom. It is certainly more relevant in for example hypothesis testing, since t-Tests (variance is estimated from the data) is much more common than z-tests (variance is treated as fixed and coming from a normal distribution).
In all of statistics or probability theory, the normal theory is however way more influential.
Nonetheless, it’s a cool bit of history where modern statistics got its roots. As a lover of both statistics and guinness, i approve!🍻
The t-student goes to the normal when your degrees of freedom get close to infinitum (in practice with 30 df they’re practically the same).
I argue that is more important because in practice you usually don’t have enough samples (or can’t resample) to use the normal distribution.
Also, the snobbery aspect of the Michelin guide is because only rich people could afford cars at the beginning.
I used to work in a Michelin star restaurant very briefly, and it’s mostly just about presentation. The food was definitely good enough high quality but you could also get good high quality food from non-michelin star restaurants, if you paid enough.
Anyway all the kitchen staff used to go to McDonald’s for their lunch, which tells you everything you really need to know about Michelin restaurants. You can get sick of fancy food.
Checks out. I used to work at Jimmy johns as a delivery driver, and almost every Friday without fail I’d get an order from a Michelin restaurant at like 430pm before they opened. Loved that delivery
Guinness the brewery started the list of records as something to keep on hand to settle arguments in pubs
That sounds like an awesome cultural thing that probably died with smartphones.
I remember being jealous of a classmate of mine in the early 00’s that got the new book as a gift every year as they always had these really flashy covers with sparkly holograms and stuff.
They still exist but now they do a website and TV shows
My world has been turned upside down
Technically it’s the tire company telling people to drive hundreds of miles to eat at specific restaurants
The initial ranking criteria is litteraly how long of a drive is the restaurant worth.
- * High-quality cooking, worth a stop
- ** Excellent cooking, worth a detour
- *** Exceptional cuisine, worth a special journey
Well it was more of a general travel guide thing but also sure why not, foodies never change lmao
Tyty I wanted to be like akshully capitalism but I’m not succinct like you.
It was so their tires would wear off faster, forcing them to buy new ones more often!
Guiness the beer company giving out world records.
Beer companies in general have a stadium/arena named after them, it gets confusing after Saku (town) has a beer company names saku and they have a stadium/arena in Tallinn (hosted Eurovision 2002 btw)
The world records thing started as a way to settle bets in bars, meaning they stayed in the bars longer and drank more Guinness. So that makes sense. Similarly, the Michelin guide was something to make the idea of driving more attractive by giving tourists dining information.
Going to have to have a Guinness while I ponder your response.
I betcha can’t do two.
Easy. I’ll down one now.
Ugh. I’ll wait a bit before the next one.
Fact: it’s really hard to down a Guinness. I tried it once. Never again.
Guinness is not gassy, so it’s a bit easier than normal beer.
Not gassy is true. Easier than normal beer? From experience, the heavyness of Guinness makes it harder.
Yes, it’s more viscous. Like downing an average milkshake.
Weird, I’ve never thought so. People say it’s so thick and heavy and you can just drink one or whatever, but I find it more filling to drink lager. It is ackshually more calories in a standard lager than in a Guinness, or so I heard. Feel free to fact check as I can’t be arsed.
Compared to many craft stouts/porters, Guinness is super thin.
Guinness has a similar amount of calories as a typical American light beer
My favourite is the Busch Stadium.
Sportsman’s Park was renamed Busch Stadium in 1953; then-team owner August Busch Jr. had planned to name it Budweiser Stadium, but at the time league rules prohibited naming a venue after an alcoholic beverage. Busch named the stadium after himself, and the Anheuser-Busch corporation later introduced “Busch Beer”.
I don’t know how I never put 2 and 2 together on that. wow
“Hey, you what will help sell more tires? Rating restaurants!” -some marketing person at Michelin
And the weird thing is it worked.
See also the Guinness Book of World Records, which is just a beer company doing some marketing to settle bar bets.
Mmmm, tires
No shit. Learning things is a hell of a thing.
Read this with Kanye West’s voice
I like some of Michelin’s tires, What the Fuck does they know about food?
The award show is funny, because any chef that wins gets to shake hands with the Michelin man.
We really did let posh wankers have too much sway on food.
I want a guide that lists everything by calories per £. If I’m going out for a meal, I want value!
I had a professor who used to time his visits to Golden Corral such that he could eat breakfast, then continue sitting through the lunch change over.
It was disgusting even to see, but it worked. I can’t imagine you could get better caloric density per dollar than that. The ratio is nearly infinite, if you’re willing to put in the work.
I can’t imagine you could get better caloric density per dollar than that.
Big sack of rice.
One gallon of gasoline.
A gallon of diesel is even better. Costs a bit more but has a sufficiently higher caloric density to more than make up for that.
Gram of Uranium
Lot of energy there of course, but kind of expensive.
Tire producers, fancy food, and cross-country bicycle races, they go together like…uh…eggs and pizza? Sure that works
His name is Mr Bibendum btw
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The whole thing is dumb. It’s a tire company. But not just that, it’s a French tire company. Name your top 3 favorite French dishes. Now name your top three favorite French restaurant. If you’re like me, you can’t even name one of either and after thinking about it, I can’t even remember even seeing a single french restaurant in my life outside of like a wine place or French bakery or something. Despite having possibly one of the least popular cuisines in all of the earth they are the ones choosing where we should all eat.
On top of that the system is super dumb. You can only have a Michelin star if your restaurant is in a place that allows them. Most states in the US are not allowed to have a Michelin star. You could be the best restaurant in all of the world but if your not in Chicago, New York City, LA, Vegas, or San Francisco too bad (and I think Miami now? Texas is about to get some too but only in Houston, Dallas and Austin cause… reasons).
In addition, they only allow a certain number of Michelin stars per location. So if you start an absolute kickass restaurant in a place that happens to allow Michelin stars but already has a few restaurants that have stars, well too bad, there aren’t any stars left. Tough shit.
But as dumb as it is… God damn is it phenomenal marketing so I guess… Good job?
The whole thing is dumb
It’s actually pretty sensible. The guide was created in 1900 to help people find Michelin tires when traveling, at a time where finding a garage or a gas station was a major issue for drivers. Then they added other stuff like hotel and restaurant recommandations. It came free with Michelin tires so it quickly became popular.
As for french culinary traditions, you may not know the dishes but it’s actually the basis for most of western cuisine… Every chef worth its salt has studied it, and French people take food pretty seriously. So it makes sense that the leading restaurant guide is French.
So if you start an absolute kickass restaurant in a place that happens to allow Michelin stars but already has a few restaurants that have stars, well too bad, there aren’t any stars left.
Every years some restaurants are demoted or even removed from the guide, precisely to make place for new, better ones. The Michelin guide is not trip advisor, it’s meant to provide a small selection of outstanding restaurants.
Found the salty american 😁
Okay so for my top 3:
Seafood if thats “a dish”, tartiflette, raclette, pot au feu, blanquette de veau, fondue, huitres, hachis parmentier… The list goes on and on.
And, but that’s only if it is correctly done (cooking each ingredient a part), you might have heard of it: ratatouille 😋
Food is more than “a dish” in France, it’s a tradition, it’s an institution.
Sure you can get crappy food like the other guy answering your post, I mean get a wrap up food in a tourist place you’ll end up with crappy food for sure, but thats like saying american beer is like piss, I tried a bud once.
🧑🍳🫕
My top 3 French foods
- Bagguette
- Chocolate au pain
- Crepe
Have you heard of the “pain au chocolat” vs “chocolatine” wars?
No my military history knowledge doesn’t extend that far
Despite having possibly one of the least popular cuisines in all of the earth they are the ones choosing where we should all eat.
It’s also funny because despite having such an “unpopular” cuisine, you likely use either “Hors d’œuvre” or “entrée” to describe the course before the main course and you probably use the word “dessert” for the sweet stuff that comes after. Or perhaps you use the term “restaurant” to describe a place where you might eat. All French.
There are some pretty well known French dishes that come to mind, fries literally being one. I do like me some coq au vin. Never tried ratatouille despite how well known it is. But I think one main problem is that a lot of French dishes that aren’t desserts, are only offered in expensive, pretentious restaurants. I’m probably never going to try foie gras, etc.
It’s also funny because despite having such an “unpopular” cuisine, you likely use either “Hors d’œuvre” or “entrée” to describe the course before the main course and you probably use the word “dessert” for the sweet stuff that comes after. Or perhaps you use the term “restaurant” to describe a place where you might eat. All French.
90% of the English food vocabulary comes from French. Words like beef, pork, vennison, mutton, veal, sauce, omelet, dinner, apéritif, café, soup, … all come from French.
Weirdly and confusingly in the U.S. at least “entree” is used for main course. I don’t know if that’s also the case in the UK or other parts of the English speaking world. “Appetizer” is normally used for the starting course; “hors-d’œuvre” usually only shows up at fancy or pretentious restaurants.
name your 3 favorite French tires
Despite having possibly one of the least popular cuisines in all of the earth
Are you fucking high? Not that there is anything wrong with being high, but this take is psychedelic levels of weird.
- crêpes / galettes
- quiches / tartes
- crème brûlée
These are fairly simple dishes. I think the main reason that “French cuisine” more generally lacks the clear profile of other national cuisines is that its components and techniques have been adopted in such a widespread manner that it has become indistinguishable from a high-end continental cuisine that is no longer uniquely French.
Man outraged map of Western Seaboard doesn’t contain directions to the moon.
- Foie gras 🪿🦆
- Snails 🐌
- Frog legs 🐸🍗
fuck foie gras!
No no no, eat foie gras! Not fuck foie gras.
ban foie gras!
Escargot is fucking amazing, but foie gras is just food based on cruelty.
I not certain to understand how eating snails would be less cruel than making foie gras. You need to starve the snails for several days before you can cook them alive.
Because they’re snails and not geese.
Or are you going to say that people who kill snails when they’re invading a garden are practicing animal cruelty?
It’s debatable, but I would say the distinction has a lot to do with how we, very subjectively, identity with the animal, how cute the animal is. I am certain snails suffer when they are crushed, or starved, but it’s hard to have empathy for them (they are small, slimy, no face, can’t scream). What about jellyfish, or plants? Very hard to define where animal cruelty starts and stops.
I am not lecturing anyone here. Just find it interesting to ponder this philosophical question.
Believe me, I don’t think geese are cute. At all. They’re horrific monsters.
But I also don’t think you can equate the suffering a goose goes through, which takes a long time, incidentally, with the suffering something we normally treat as a pest might go through.
French fries!
… Invented in Belgium. IIRC some soldiers had them in Belgium and brought them home but mistook the origin to be France since they speak French in Belgium.
It’s not clear where exactly the “French fries” were invented, but the most commonly admitted story is that it was invented in France and perfected in Belgium.
Yeah that’s what I remember as well, I was joking :)
-
Coq au vin
-
Croissant
-
Blancmange
-
When I was traveling internationally there was a few countries where packing snacks was required. This was especially true if you were stuck in conventions or meetings for the week.
France was the consistently the absolute worst country for food. Everybody pretends to know what they are doing making complex dishes. Here’s a hint, they don’t. I had more inedible food served to me in France than any other country I traveled too.
So why the Michelin star system started in France makes perfect sense to me. In a nation of shitty food, these are passibly edible.
As for the marketing side of it: artificially creating a impression of superiority and exclusivity is a core technique to sell luxury items. It’s been around for as long as some people have believed they were superior to others. Yes it is dumb, but it works.
Next time avoid tourist traps and go to places listed on le fooding or, well, the Michelin guide :)
I have to side with @The_v@lemmy.world here.
I live in Belgium and I’ve been to France many times, for both work and leisure. I’ve eaten very well in France on occasion, but generally speaking it is indeed harder to find good places to eat, and reviews and even recommendations by local coworkers often haven’t been in line with my own experience. The amount of overpriced leather shoe sole steaks that I’ve had to endure… Paris is obviously the worst, because of the many tourist traps and it being an unfriendly city in general, but even in the Provence and in smaller towns, we had to be more mindful of which place to pick.
Especially finding good “simple” food in a casual setting can be a challenge, I mean, nobody wants to do the full white tablecloth 4-course fine dining thing every night. Here in Belgium, even in touristy places, you can always find a decent brasserie or casual restaurant where they serve the simple classics well, things like moules frites, a decent entrecôte, flemish stew, or even a simple pasta or burger.
Here in Belgium, even in touristy places, you can always find a decent brasserie or casual restaurant where they serve the simple classics well, things like moules frites, a decent entrecôte, flemish stew, or even a simple pasta or burger.
There are bistros like that everywhere in France (minus the moules frites I guess :), maybe I’m used to spotting the nice ones but I’ve almost never had a bad experience with them.
Next time you should check on le fooding like I said above, that’s what I use when I’m in a new place and so far I’ve never been disappointed.
There are bistros like that everywhere in France (minus the moules frites I guess :), maybe I’m used to spotting the nice ones but I’ve almost never had a bad experience with them.
I know, it’s just that I have had more mediocre experiences with them, to say it kindly.
Didn’t know about le fooding, will try to keep it in mind next time.
This actually reminds me that I had one of the worst steaks in my life in Paris; I asked for medium but it was fully cooked, overcooked actually, yet cold. My onion soup was also cold. The only silver lining was we got a more expensive bottle of wine and only later back at our room noticed on the receipt they didn’t charge us for it. That was our second bad result after looking at “highly rated” nearby listings on Google Maps in Paris so we stopped using Google Maps. Fortunately my wife’s aunt had given her a Michelin “Routiers” book, which I think was less fancy than the standard Michelin guide, and we ate at an excellent restaurant the next night, just not as close to our rental.
It was such a a stark contrast when I would hit 3 to 5 countries in 2 weeks. The only places close to as bad as France was Chile and Tunisia. And honestly it wasn’t inedible in either of those countries just very bland and boring.
It seriously was a shock the fist time I went and put it down to bad luck. Then every return trip was exactly the same.
Thank you for the website; I’ll send this to my wife. Her parents emigrated from France to Canada before she was born and we went to France last year with her parents to visit their family, her first time over since she was a small child. We’re hoping to get back a lot sooner!
Such a very french answer…
When traveling for internationally for business, as the guest to the country you don’t pick where you eat. The host normally takes people out to a decent place or has food catered. So these were all places picked by locals.
My bad, I assumed you’d have done a little bit of research and exploring before labeling the extensive and varied French cuisine as “shitty”.
